Well, 51 years of originality will soon be at an end..

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DanC
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Location: Carlisle, Cumbria

Well, 51 years of originality will soon be at an end..

Post by DanC » Sat Mar 02, 2013 8:44 pm

Today I had about a 100 mile run in the Dormi and it was a dream, this coincides with it going away for a few weeks and I am having one of those melancholy moments.. Right or wrong it has gone off to have the original head replaced with an ACR unit, the carbs replaced with SU and an alternator conversion and electronic ignition. I am also fitting an overdrive and new rear springs to level it up (less contentious). Anyway, I felt quite sad leaving it at the garage (I don't usually farm these things out btw, but I have to deal with 2no 88"s and a complicated home life and need the Dormi for April/May). It makes sense, I am keeping the original 2.25 but the unleaded head and 9:1 compression will improve things no end and it needs the other bits doing... I have to convert to negative earth so I can fit an alternator for split charge etc.. Also after-market electrical goods require it!

As Mick says, it needs to earn its living so the changes are necessary, all the bits will be mothballed to stay with the vehicle. It is just that it ran so well today, pulled like a steam train, did over 100miles with ease, I can see how it has been around Europe before, if only fuel were still as cheap and traffic as slow, the 7:1 head might have been a stayer! Someone say something to make me feel better about being the one to change it.....
'The Wagon' 1962 Martin Walters Dormobile, 2.25 Petrol
'Bessy' 1965 2.25 88" diesel
'Daisy' 1958 2.25 88" diesel
overlander
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Re: Well, 51 years of originality will soon be at an end..

Post by overlander » Sat Mar 02, 2013 10:15 pm

Relax Dan, the standard 2.25 petrol in my Carawagon, fully laden for long distance touring, was OK when pootling round undulating country roads but struggled in the mountains and in sandy conditions in the desert. And motorway cruising was not comfortable as I struggled to pass HGVs so I had a 200Tdi fitted (thanks Big Dave) and the vehicle was transformed. However I recently parted with the ex Jerry T S2 SWB which was fitted with the ACR test bed 2.25 petrol engine (115bhp) and the performance was staggering - mind you it had the works - ported, HC head, semi downdraft SU carb, stainless steel exhaust, lightened flywheel etc etc. I don't think you'll be disappointed in the performance but work on getting about 16mpg - roughly what PKR got when he took his mildly tuned LR Dormobile to Morocco a few years back.

cheers

John H
AlexB
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Re: Well, 51 years of originality will soon be at an end..

Post by AlexB » Sun Mar 03, 2013 8:52 am

Dan
I suspect that if you made a list of the pros and cons, advantages and disadvantages of keeping it as a "museum piece" versus letting evolve to suit today's world and what you intend to use it for, it would make interesting reading.

Surely, with such a vehicle, use as Martin Walter intended, must be the over riding factor, and the little things to make it more useable and comfortable make sense.

My second Dormobile will, hopefully, have more evolution than the first - 5 speed box, more soundproofing, twin batteries, etc, as 3 years with the first have made us realise that, Dormobiling is great, but after tours of Scandinavia, Switzerland, Germany and France, lots of Folk Festivals, (6000 miles per year), it has its niggle points, and as we intend to spend lots of time continuing to Dormobile, these need to be eradicated.

My (and Esther's) view anyway.

Je ne regret rien!
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DanC
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Re: Well, 51 years of originality will soon be at an end..

Post by DanC » Sun Mar 03, 2013 9:23 am

Cheers both,

I guess it is a good point, it was running great yesterday but not fully loaded, although two adult males. I think it may be the fact that it is not being done by me that bothers me most, but hey ho. The 9:1 head and su carb should improve mpg, but not to tdi standards. A few bhp in reserve will be useful though and dynamos and positive earth just isnt practical. Oh well, it will be back in a few weeks so we will see.

Inverness to Carlisle in the 2.25d should be fun next weekend...
'The Wagon' 1962 Martin Walters Dormobile, 2.25 Petrol
'Bessy' 1965 2.25 88" diesel
'Daisy' 1958 2.25 88" diesel
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RMS
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Re: Well, 51 years of originality will soon be at an end..

Post by RMS » Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:09 am

Hi Dan,

Well, I wish I had an original vehicle - all of ours have either been rebuilt on new (or good) chassis, sometimes, in the case of my latest one, on the wrong chassis & bulkhead :thud:

I think if I had an original one I might try to keep it that way as much as I can, but with the original engine it would only get used for local shows etc.

I certainly think, in today's traffic conditions and economic climate, a reasonable power unit and gearing is essential for longer, esp. motorway & continental, trips - in my opinion, of course :tiphat:
That's why the vehicle(s) I use for longer trips have 200/300TDi and 3.54 diffs and/or overdrive.
That makes a nice relaxing cruiser, meaning I get to my destination without worrying about hills and filling up every 160 miles :embarassed:


Have fun next weekend - as you know, I only managed about 5 miles in a 2.25D before declaring I never wanted to drive one again :roll:

Cheers,
Robin.
1967 109" Carawagon 200TDi
1972 109" SW Carawagon 2.5NA
1958 109" Carawagon 2.25P (project)
1972 109" Carawagon 200 or 300TDi (project)
1974 Dormobile 2.25D (project)
(Robin on S2C forum)
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DanC
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Re: Well, 51 years of originality will soon be at an end..

Post by DanC » Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:19 am

Well, it will still mostly be the original engine, just a new head! The original head, carb, distributor and dynamo will be mothballed so they stay with the Wagon should it ever become an requirement to go back to bog standard (highly unlikely). I like to think of it as sympathetic improvements, still running an original engine but a few performance tweaks. Anyway, any fears will probably be allayed when I bring her back done, I fully expect to be amazed with the improvements and never look back!!!!

5 miles in a 2.25d is not going to get you road warrior status Robin....... TBF I am in an 88" which is slightly less sluggish and it is a very good recon engine, when they are good they are good.... Still, even with overdrive, 55mph is going to be a push so it will take about 6 hours to get home (stopping only for fuel).
'The Wagon' 1962 Martin Walters Dormobile, 2.25 Petrol
'Bessy' 1965 2.25 88" diesel
'Daisy' 1958 2.25 88" diesel
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RMS
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Location: Near Wakefield, UK, in God's own Country!

Re: Well, 51 years of originality will soon be at an end..

Post by RMS » Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:35 am

Patrick still has the 6 pot engine, which came out of his Carawagon, in his garage.

He likes to think that one day he'll be rich enough to be able to run it :whistle:
1967 109" Carawagon 200TDi
1972 109" SW Carawagon 2.5NA
1958 109" Carawagon 2.25P (project)
1972 109" Carawagon 200 or 300TDi (project)
1974 Dormobile 2.25D (project)
(Robin on S2C forum)
Jabbawocky
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Re: Well, 51 years of originality will soon be at an end..

Post by Jabbawocky » Sun Mar 03, 2013 9:59 pm

HI Dan

When you have the new head fitted, you will realise how de-tuned the original engine is. She will drive completely differently. You will get a lot more useable rpm in all gears and the driving pleasure will be much improved as you will keep up with all the other traffic. The only problem with this is, you will keep up with the traffic and your fuel economy will not improve that much at all. It's nothing really to do with the engine, it's the fact that you are in a Dormobile and that extra bit of roof has a major effect on all ready poor aerodynamics. Having fitted a Dormobile roof to an existing vehicle, I was shocked by the negative effect on top speed and fuel economy.

As for making the changes, Land Rovers are working vehicle and for using, not looking at. As Alex say, make them a useable as possible and go enjoy yourself.

Alex. I would be interested to hear all of your niggle points and strategies to eliminate them.

Cheers Mick
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DanC
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Location: Carlisle, Cumbria

Re: Well, 51 years of originality will soon be at an end..

Post by DanC » Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:12 pm

Yup, I guess I will Mick... I have factored in the MPG issue, it should improve from current but not by an excessive amount (as I am fitting a more thermally efficient head, a more fuel efficient carb, overdrive and radial road biased tyres). But, the truth is I know that my trip to Europe is going to be fuel heavy, I am just looking forward to doing it with a broadly original engine... But, it is horses for courses, maybe one day I will go on a real big journey again and stick a tdi or something else in to facilitate it, as everyone knows I am firmly in the 'do what you want without criticism camp'... I am leaving for Italy around the 23rd of July... France-Switzerland-Italy-France-Kent if anybody wants to tag along for a bit of the journey :tiphat:
'The Wagon' 1962 Martin Walters Dormobile, 2.25 Petrol
'Bessy' 1965 2.25 88" diesel
'Daisy' 1958 2.25 88" diesel
AlexB
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Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 8:01 am

Re: Well, 51 years of originality will soon be at an end..

Post by AlexB » Mon Mar 04, 2013 5:10 pm

I hope this will be taken in the spirit of the original post rather than a hijack, in response to Mick's words on what we have found less than endearing and what we are doing about it;

Noise
As those of us with them, know, the TDI engine is a noisy thing, radios become superfluous, conversation is strained.
The new dormobile has sound insulation all over the bulkhead which was put on the bare bulkhead
The bonnet will also be insulated, as will a lot of other areas - potentially seat box and possibly the doors.

Gearing
TDI plus 3.5 diffs plus overdrive means that roundabouts on the continent involve a double declutch from third to second, and overdrive shift, whilst indicating and spotting the maniac frenchman in the C15 trying to overtake on the blind side.
The LT77 should sort that out. To be fair, the overdrive in the green Dormobile whines a lot, so that doesn't help the noise either.

Ventilation
Windows take a while to demist and the side effect of opening them is a cold ear / neck.
Military door tops should solve this.

Rattles
Not heard many to be honest as the tdi and overdrive cover that noise!

Added extras
twin batteries and split charging is on the cards
cutting the floor as per the green Dormobile a la Mick for the portapotti is a must
debating on how far to run awning rail
still not decided about the "missing" front seat - do I swop from the green dormobile (would rather not), build a cubby box that folds in half (when open) to provide bed space, or hope that a spare front seat will finally turn up?
hazards are a possiblity

There you go - food for thought!!

Apologies for the hijack - can start another thread or happy for Robin to move it.
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